New head coach for 2025 - who should they hire?

[brasilbear]

Nov 4, 2024 12:08:33 GMT -6 The Marshall Plan said:

Nov 4, 2024 11:01:07 GMT -6 brasilbear said:

I understand all that. He was the greatest ST-coord Chicago ever had. But, that still doesn't say anything to me about why he should he hired.

You are however the first guy who ever defended including Toub and I appreciate that. Usually I get: "Duh!! Greatest ST-coord in Chicago!! Derp!! Go Bears!!" 

If you really understood it then you wouldn’t have needed to ask in the first place.

Really? Thats how you want to respond? Aren't you the guy who complained about another poster and how he answered you? Do you understand how discussion works? At this point, why should anyone ever reply to any comment you make? You don't really have a argument do you. Maybe you should type less and listen to what other people say. There are many posters on here apparently better versed in the niceties of discussion and the back and forth that this board has cultivated. Apparently you aren't one of them.

Serious advice here, posters like you with attitudes you have don't last long or worse become irrelevant to any discussion they join. No one is going to try to enter any discussion with you if your attitude is what you posted in reply to me. We've worked hard as a group to eliminate trollish responses and flat out disrespect to poster here. As a result we have discussions, back and forths between various viewpoints. We respond to each other and for the most part answer questions respectfully. 

But you? Consider yourself on ignore. I'll never read another post you make, no matter how insightful it is. Congrats, you're starting down the path to irrelevance here on chitown-bears.com. Like almost everyone here, I want mostly serious discussion of my favorite sports team. I can do with childish posturing and belittling attempts to "own" another poster.

[brasilbear]

To bring this discussion back from the children's table (sorry about that):

This is a start. If people want to add Toub, that works for me. I think Daboll should be on there as well. In Daboll's favor, I think he'll come cheaper than Johnson. I really, really, really want Ben Johnson

[shortfacedbear]

Nov 4, 2024 10:36:40 GMT -6 The Marshall Plan said:

Nov 4, 2024 10:24:20 GMT -6 brasilbear said:

What experience does Dabe Toub have? Serious question. His name comes up every time the talk about Bears HCs. He has no experience on the OFF side, almost no experience on the DEF side. He's never called plays at any level.

Here is his coaching resume:

UTEP (1986) Graduate assistant
UTEP (1987–1988) Strength and conditioning coach
Missouri (1989–1997) Strength and conditioning coach
Missouri (1998–2000) Defensive line coach
Philadelphia Eagles (2001–2003) Special teams & quality control coach
Chicago Bears (2004–2012) Special teams coordinator
Kansas City Chiefs (2013–2017) Special teams coordinator
Kansas City Chiefs (2018–present) Assistant head coach & special teams coordinator

Whats the attraction to an organization here? I'm not trolling, what does he bring other than 3 SB rings as a special teams coord? Again, as a special teams coordinator, not a play caller, not a play designer, not a game planner....

Toub has been coaching for an eternity and is regarded as either the best or one of the best special teams coaches in the game. He has spent a considerable amount of time in KC with Andy Reid as well.

A Head Coach should spend his time head coaching. Not on calling offensive or defensive schemes. He needs to lead men.

There are OCs and DCs for a reason. Let them call the plays.

This. I'm for Toub then Johnson.

[bears40]

Nov 4, 2024 12:22:18 GMT -6 brasilbear said:

To bring this discussion back from the children's table (sorry about that):

This is a start. If people want to add Toub, that works for me. I think Daboll should be on there as well. In Daboll's favor, I think he'll come cheaper than Johnson. I really, really, really want Ben Johnson

Agree on Johnson. He’d be a good hire assuming he gets the right guy as his OC. I don’t see him filling both roles. Interesting thought on Daboll, he’d at least have some HC experience.

[brasilbear]

Nov 4, 2024 17:12:59 GMT -6 bears40 said:

Nov 4, 2024 12:22:18 GMT -6 brasilbear said:

To bring this discussion back from the children's table (sorry about that):

This is a start. If people want to add Toub, that works for me. I think Daboll should be on there as well. In Daboll's favor, I think he'll come cheaper than Johnson. I really, really, really want Ben Johnson

Agree on Johnson. He’d be a good hire ass7ming he gets the right guy as his OC. I don’t see him filling both roles. Interesting thought on Daboll, he’d at least have some HC experience.

We always say we want a HC with experience, and who worked with a young QB (Allen in Buff). So he fits those requirements.

[Whisky Beer Bob]

Nov 4, 2024 18:23:17 GMT -6 brasilbear said:

Nov 4, 2024 17:12:59 GMT -6 bears40 said:

Agree on Johnson. He’d be a good hire ass7ming he gets the right guy as his OC. I don’t see him filling both roles. Interesting thought on Daboll, he’d at least have some HC experience.

We always say we want a HC with experience, and who worked with a young QB (Allen in Buff). So he fits those requirements.

I liked Daboll at one time as well but he hasn't exactly lit it up over in New York. I know we have a great deal of skilled players on both sides of the ball but I now feel like Daboll needs to go back to OC a year or so and get his plans sorted.

 If we are considering Daboll then Kingsbury should be in serious contention. The only reason he didn't get hired to begin with was the fact that he wanted another shot at a HC position ASAP. 

 Did anyone mention Klint Kubiak? He would be a young hire but at least he is current but inexperienced. I am not sure if Washington would stick around at DC but Salah is available and would give some experience.

[bearsinhouston]

Nov 4, 2024 19:28:32 GMT -6 Whisky Beer Bob said:

Nov 4, 2024 18:23:17 GMT -6 brasilbear said:

We always say we want a HC with experience, and who worked with a young QB (Allen in Buff). So he fits those requirements.

I liked Daboll at one time as well but he hasn't exactly lit it up over in New York. I know we have a great deal of skilled players on both sides of the ball but I now feel like Daboll needs to go back to OC a year or so and get his plans sorted.

 If we are considering Daboll then Kingsbury should be in serious contention. The only reason he didn't get hired to begin with was the fact that he wanted another shot at a HC position ASAP. 

 Did anyone mention Klint Kubiak? He would be a young hire but at least he is current but inexperienced. I am not sure if Washington would stick around at DC but Salah is available and would give some experience.

This is where I am at with Daboll also. I did like him but would take a pass at this point. Kubiak is an interesting choice though

[brasilbear]

Nov 4, 2024 19:38:18 GMT -6 bearsinhouston said:

Nov 4, 2024 19:28:32 GMT -6 Whisky Beer Bob said:

I liked Daboll at one time as well but he hasn't exactly lit it up over in New York. I know we have a great deal of skilled players on both sides of the ball but I now feel like Daboll needs to go back to OC a year or so and get his plans sorted.

 If we are considering Daboll then Kingsbury should be in serious contention. The only reason he didn't get hired to begin with was the fact that he wanted another shot at a HC position ASAP. 

 Did anyone mention Klint Kubiak? He would be a young hire but at least he is current but inexperienced. I am not sure if Washington would stick around at DC but Salah is available and would give some experience.

This is where I am at with Daboll also. I did like him but would take a pass at this point. Kubiak is an interesting choice though

The Daboll concerns hit the nail on the head. He was "the hot candidate," to the point that the Bears were hammered for not hiring him over Nagy. It turned out to be a wash in the end (IMO) but you just don't know what you are getting quite often even with coaches. Even LaFleur was an unknown, the sole point in his favor being his connection to the Shanahan tree. He was the OC in Tenn (2018--only 1 season) where his OFF ranked 27th in points and was the titled OC for the Rams in 2017 (where McVay calls plays). Turned into a great hire.

Even before Carr went down the Kubiak OFF in NO had started to come back down the rankings. Injuries for sure played a apart. I'd be  intrigued with Kubiak HC/OC and Salah/Vrabel DC.  Any of the young OCs I'd be in favor of.

[weneedmorelinemen]

Nov 4, 2024 11:11:59 GMT -6 brasilbear said:

Nov 4, 2024 11:07:01 GMT -6 bearsinhouston said:

As a general statement, I like ST background because they have a fuller appreciation of the game (IMO). I do get that he has not called plays. But as a HC, he doesn't need to either. 

I get that HC don't have to call plays (even though in todays NFL most do). But he's never had experience creating an OFF or DEF game plan or as far as we know an OFF or DEF philosophy. All HCs (with the exception of John Harbaugh who ironically was a ST-coord--ha ha ha) have at some point been either an OC or DC, called plays or at least signed plays.

I'm not comfortable turning Williams over to a HC that has never been in a position where he (or she) has called plays for either side of the ball. Others disagree.

I would be okay bringing Dave Toub in as a head coach.

He is currently the assistant head coach in Kansas City for the past six years under a first ballot HoF coach Andy Reid. He has multiple Superbowl rings. If they didn't value him, they would fire him.

Maybe, just maybe, he's learned how to challenge bad football ref calls.

Maybe he knows how to not run a backup offensive lineman as a running back in a tight game.

Maybe he can coach a team to not collapse and lose close games. Flus has lost so many nailbiters, and it has many times been his fault.

Maybe Toub is not boring as hell to listen to. That's one of my takeaways from Hard Knocks. Watching Flus was like watching paint dry.

I've heard that special teams coaches have a unique perspective on coaching players because they have to work with both offensive and defensive players into their plays, and these players aren't the most talented.

I don't think Toub would take the offer. I think he might be the guy they give KC to once Andy Reid decides to retire.

[mpbears68]

www.windycitygridiron.com/2024/11/5/24287905/hot-take-tuesday-chicago-bears-will-never-learn-from-their-own-mistakes-caleb-williams-development