The NFL Route Tree............

[Deleted]

Sept 14, 2016 8:53:03 GMT -6 hawkeye21 said:

For some reason it seems some people think White just doesn't know how to run basic routes but I would bet he's just struggling to remember which route needs to be run on which plays. The only thing that's going to help him with that is studying the playbook more and lots of reps. If he can't get a feel for running the right routes and getting open against defenses then he is hopeless. At that point I would consider him a bust.

Hawk I understand your desire to keep defending the kid.  I'm hoping like hell we haven't got another wasted pick on our hands too.  But it's also a well know and commonly accepted fact that they never asked him to run the entire route tree at WVU from even one receiver position let alone two or all three.  If it's not a lack of knowledge and understanding by now then it's a lack of focus so the result would be about the same.

I don't know it for a fact as far as the Bears go but typically when a pass play is called in the huddle the QB specifies the routes.  So if he calls X-Curl.....Z-Out.....Y-Seam and White is the Flanker or Z on that play then he's being told to run an out at whatever depth is standard for that play.  All he really needs to know is the proper way to run that out and to not stop, round it off or cut his route short.  The QB is gonna throw to the spot he expects the receiver to be at.

BB also brought up the need for all of the WRs to learn to make sight reads and I admit that may be where he struggles and gets confused but I don't believe those are as much a part of this offense as they were with Trestman's where he wanted Cutler to throw more prior to the receivers breaks.  With Cutler's arm strength he seems to be more comfortable seeing his guy make that break and come open them deliver a cannon shot throw to the guy.

If you go back and watch that TD pass to Royal you can see just how fast that ball got to him once Cutler saw he was isolated on one DB and the DB was playing outside leverage on him.  He threw for Royal's back shoulder and got it there before the Safety could close on the throw.  Jay is one of the few QBs I've ever seen who can throw into windows like that successfully.  Rodgers is another.

We'll see how it goes in the next few games.  I'm hoping Cutler doesn't lose confidence in him but if he does then they should bench him until he gets it because he's only hurting the team until he does.  That's just my opinion on it.

[brasilbear]

Sept 14, 2016 12:41:29 GMT -6 @soulman said:

Sept 14, 2016 8:53:03 GMT -6 hawkeye21 said:

For some reason it seems some people think White just doesn't know how to run basic routes but I would bet he's just struggling to remember which route needs to be run on which plays. The only thing that's going to help him with that is studying the playbook more and lots of reps. If he can't get a feel for running the right routes and getting open against defenses then he is hopeless. At that point I would consider him a bust.

...........
BB also brought up the need for all of the WRs to learn to make sight reads and I admit that may be where he struggles and gets confused but I don't believe those are as much a part of this offense as they were with Trestman's where he wanted Cutler to throw more prior to the receivers breaks.  With Cutler's arm strength he seems to be more comfortable seeing his guy make that break and come open them deliver a cannon shot throw to the guy.

.......

And just to make it clear, I'm not saying that all plays have sight adjustments, and some offenses have more sight adjustments than others. It may be, like soulman said, that every play is set when called. Some offenses always have hot routes built in where the WR and QB have to recognize a blitz and adjust accordingly, some don't. Without knowing the Bears OFF we are only guessing. However, like soul said, most likely White is struggling with play calls and which route to run.

[tragicslip]

Run 9s until he figures it out. That is all.

It's not just the call brasilbear, it is lazy route running: cutting them short, rounding off routes and a basket full more of similar crap. Lack of concentration would explain bad routes and drops

[Deleted]

I though Rich Campbell and Dan Wiederer had a pretty thorough discussion of him in another thread I posted.  I'm gonna take my more recent comments to that thread.

[shortfacedbear]

I can understand if he was thrown in the slot and I can understand first game jitters and needing game experience. What baffles me is White being befuddled if he's flipped to the other side.

With an entire year to familiarize himself with the playbook, depth of routes, and adjustments therein I really hope he has better outings.

If we have the conversation mid-season about White not running a route from the tree that should be ingrained then we pretty much have the plaster in hand for the bust.

[omc1969]

Sept 14, 2016 20:44:23 GMT -6 shortfacedbear said:

I can understand if he was thrown in the slot and I can understand first game jitters and needing game experience. What baffles me is White being befuddled if he's flipped to the other side.

With an entire year to familiarize himself with the playbook, depth of routes, and adjustments therein I really hope he has better outings.

If we have the conversation mid-season about White not running a route from the tree that should be ingrained then we pretty much have the plaster in hand for the bust.

White had ALL of last season to learn the plays and variations. I seems he did not use that time wisely. I also will give him more time but not much.

[AlexM]

Sept 15, 2016 7:23:25 GMT -6 omc1969 said:

Sept 14, 2016 20:44:23 GMT -6 shortfacedbear said:

I can understand if he was thrown in the slot and I can understand first game jitters and needing game experience. What baffles me is White being befuddled if he's flipped to the other side.

With an entire year to familiarize himself with the playbook, depth of routes, and adjustments therein I really hope he has better outings.

If we have the conversation mid-season about White not running a route from the tree that should be ingrained then we pretty much have the plaster in hand for the bust.

White had ALL of last season to learn the plays and variations. I seems he did not use that time wisely. I also will give him more time but not much.

Hes a 1st round pick, and the first one of the new GM. We all know what that means, so we better get used to White  

[brasilbear]

Hoge is saying it is an option route, but I don't know how Hoge knows this.

"White’s route was an option route that was dictated by the defensive coverage. Initially he sits on the route in the middle of the field, as Texans safety Andre Hal bit on the play-action. Had White initially continued his route to the sideline, he likely would have been wide open. But he didn’t, and there was enough time for Cutler to realize this."

da-bears.proboards.com/thread/224/adam-hoges-10-bears

[Deleted]

Sept 15, 2016 11:49:27 GMT -6 brasilbear said:

Hoge is saying it is an option route, but I don't know how Hoge knows this.

"White’s route was an option route that was dictated by the defensive coverage. Initially he sits on the route in the middle of the field, as Texans safety Andre Hal bit on the play-action. Had White initially continued his route to the sideline, he likely would have been wide open. But he didn’t, and there was enough time for Cutler to realize this."

da-bears.proboards.com/thread/224/adam-hoges-10-bears

He doesn't.  It's his interpretation of it and I disagree with it too.  I posted my take on it in that thread of Hoge's Then Things I just posted.

Hal's movement upfield vs White's had he continued his route would have created even more separation than the 2-2 1/2 yards we see in that screen shot.  KW would have been several more yards behind him and outside of him as well.  Cutler threw high and to front side of the route right at the 37 yard line where White's out route should have placed him.

Cutler may well have seen the DB and realized where he was but that doesn't change how he placed the throw so that had White run his route correctly he was in all likelihood the only one who could have caught the ball.  Even after he retreated to cover White Hal had to dive to get to it. 

That's what I see it on the replays.   Hoge and others may see it differently but no matter how we interpret what happened it was clearly White who hung Cutler out to dry not the other way around.